The following is a transcript of an interview with Ret. Gen. H.R. McMaster, National Security Advisor in the first Trump administration, on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan,” broadcast November 24, 2024.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We now turn to retired Army Lt. Gen. H.R. McMaster, who served as national security adviser in the first Trump administration. His latest book is “At War With Ourselves,” which chronicles his time in the White House. Good morning and welcome back.
LT. GENERAL HR MCMASTER: Good morning Margaret, Happy Thanksgiving.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Happy early Thanksgiving to you. I want to ask you about the geopolitical threat assessment that the next Commander in Chief will be walking into the Oval Office at this moment. In these last weeks, the Biden administration, Ukraine has begun using US-made ATACMS, a type of longer-range missile, to attack Russian territory. President Biden also approved anti-personnel landmines. The goal is to give them a stronger base before Trump comes to power. Can these weapons make a difference quickly?
LT. GENERAL HR MCMASTER: They can make a difference, Margaret. It really made no sense not to allow the Ukrainians to fire those missiles at the bases that Russia was using to continue their attack on the Ukrainian people and infrastructure. And so it’s another one of these examples of how the Biden administration has taken this hesitant approach to providing weapons and then permission to use weapons. And so I think it’s important because both sides are now incentivized to make as many gains as possible on the battlefield before the new Trump administration arrives, and you see Russia throwing troops into the Ukrainian defense. I mean, they kill tens of thousands every month. I think this is really an unsustainable percentage. And what the Ukrainians are doing now is trying to protect themselves from the attack and inflict as many victims as possible. And they trade some space for time and the opportunity to cause more depletion of the Russian forces. So the next few months, I think, are really crucial in terms of how, what is the next phase in the war in Ukraine.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You know, President Zelensky said yesterday that he’s sure Vladimir Putin is trying to “push us out by January 20” and try to demonstrate that he has the upper hand. He doesn’t say that, you know, it’s just an observation: he’s looking at the National Security Advisor, Mike Waltz. He looks to the possible next Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, who voted against aid to Ukraine; the newly elected vice president is against helping Ukraine. Can Ukraine gain the upper hand here, and will these top advisors be convinced?
LT. GENERAL HR MCMASTER: Well, this is a real problem, Margaret. You know, I think what you see is that this represents a psychological blow to the Ukrainians. The Ukrainians are struggling to generate the manpower they need and sustain their defensive efforts. And that is, it’s important that they get the weapons they need and the training they need, but they also need to have the confidence that they can overcome. And any kind of message that we could reduce our aid is quite damaging to them from a moral perspective. I think, and I hope, that those whom President Trump nominated, and President Trump himself, will begin to see the obvious connections between the war in Ukraine and this axis of aggressors bent on destroying power. existing international order. I mean, Margaret, I mean, North Korean soldiers are fighting on European soil in the first major war in Europe since World War II. Look at what China is doing to maintain the Russian war machine, with the money that Vladimir Putin needs, but also with the equipment and hardware needed to build these missiles that continue this attack. Iran- Iran supplies the Shahed drones and missiles. North Korea also supplies eight million artillery shells. So I think what’s happened is that so many people have had such a myopic view of Ukraine, and they’ve misunderstood Putin’s intentions and how important the war is to our interests around the world.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, one of the things, and you’re a historian, you’ve done a lot of writing and looking at presidential decision-making. One of the things you wrote in “At War With Ourselves” was that, based on your study of the Vietnam War, it is important to “ensure that the president is given the best analysis and multiple options so that he can make informed decisions. .” Do you think so far that Trump’s choices as Director of National Intelligence, as Secretary of Defense, are these individuals who will give the President the best analysis and what he needs to hear, and not just what he wants to belong?
LT. GENERAL HR MCMASTER: Well, this is what the Senate needs to do: really exercise its advisory and consent role. And I think it’s worth going back to Federalist 76, where John Adams said this: This advice and this permission is so important to making sure that the best people are in those positions. President Trump, as I wrote in the book, he does learn, he does listen to advice. He develops his understanding. So who will those people be? I think the new Secretary of Defense, the appointed Director of National Intelligence, should be asked, what do you think motivates, drives and constrains Vladimir Putin? There is a fundamental misunderstanding based on the DNI nominee about what motivates them. It’s not his safety issues. His safety concerns need not be allayed. That’s the mistake that the Biden administration made, and I think as a result, the invasion, the re-invasion of Ukraine in February 2022, almost got the green light. What are the consequences if Ukraine fails and Russia succeeds, globally? I think, Margaret, they need to be asked about, you know, really, how can they reconcile, or help President Trump reconcile, peace through strength? And what you see in some elements of the Republican Party, who often replicate the far left in the direction of austerity and disengagement and then even blame ourselves for the actions of our opponents, just as Tulsi Gabbard has done, you know, while he talked about how Putin felt really aggrieved, and that’s why he had to invade Ukraine.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right, that’s a Russian talking point that she’s been repeating, which is in direct conflict with what U.S. intelligence has concluded. I also want to ask about someone you…
LT. GENERAL HR MCMASTER: This is what I don’t understand, Margaret. There are people in the Republican Party these days who tend to parrot Vladimir Putin’s talking points. I don’t know if it’s because they’re attracted to him and see him as some kind of defender of Western civilization, just the shirtless guy on horseback, but they have to rid themselves of that, you know, weird. affection for Vladimir Putin. You know, who, who is, who will not stop in his attempt to restore Russia to national greatness at our expense. That’s what he’s obsessed with. He is obsessed with the kind of restoration of the Russian Empire. And so he has ambitions that go far beyond anything that is a response to what we do. And the only thing holding it back is strength, Margaret.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And you wrote in your book that you didn’t understand Donald Trump’s fascination with Vladimir Putin. Seb Gorka will soon become senior director of counterterrorism and deputy assistant to the president. Is he a good person to advise on national security?
LT. GENERAL HR MCMASTER: No, no, he’s not, Margaret. But you know, I think the president, and others working with him, will probably determine that pretty quickly, shortly after he gets that job.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Okay. Timestamp on that prediction. HR McMaster, there’s a lot to talk to you about. For today we have to leave it at that. We’ll be right back.
